Episode 302 | Amanda Gulino of A Better Monday.
Today Dannie and Caitlyn are talking with Amanda Gulino of A Better Monday.
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Episode Transcript
Intro: [00:00:00] You're listening to the side hustle GAL podcast with your host Dannie Fountain and Caitlyn Allen.
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:00:21] Hello and welcome back to the side hustle gal podcast. Today's guest might be one of my favorites from the season, but I don't pick favorites. We are chatting with Amanda Gulino today who I actually met. While we were in Denver, together as two strangers coming together from across the country, um, as part of Denver startup week, we were two of the 50 ambassadors for that program. Um, and I've been stocking Amanda ever since. So this is great. And to get to talk today. So Amanda, thank you so much for coming on and tell us about your side hustle.
Amanda Gulino: [00:01:02] Of course that might've been the best. Intro of all time, I've also been talking to some similar startup week. It what dannie fails to mention is that we met on the first day of Denver startup week and this kind of, it was maybe a bit overwhelming as an introvert, a bit overwhelming and yet awesome.
Lunch at this great, uh, coworking space. And then. You just kept saying stuff. The whole time we were at startup week, I was like, I just need to know her. I need to connect with her more. I have to. Um, so this is a really fun way to come together. Um, okay. So a little bit about me. So, uh, my name is Amanda. I'm originally from Baton Rouge, Louisiana.
I was born and raised there. Went to college, they went to LSU. And uh, that was really, that time in my life at college was really what unlocked a passion that I didn't know I could have and I didn't know I could do for work. And that was all about people. And, and. You know what I was thinking this morning about like why?
Why am I doing all this work? Like the bit of a stressful morning and I came back to like what I'm on a mission to do and that at the end of the day, that's to make work something that's enjoyable for people and doesn't suck. Like that's really it. Why I'm doing this, because we spend so much time. So much of our waking hours working, we should be getting some enjoyment out of it.
And the best part of that is when we're enjoying it, our bosses and our managers and our clients or whoever, they're going to be getting more good work out of us and everybody wins. Right? Um, so, so that's really what I'm on a mission to do. Um, I started my side hustle in. August of 2016 and it was sort of a happy accident.
Um, before that time I had been floating around all sorts of ideas of like what I wanted to do. Um, I was like, I'm going to open a smoothie shop. I'm going to open a yoga studio. I mean, really, I went all over the place. I think at one point. There was a clothing store with only black and gray clothing in there, which I still might do cause that's all I wear.
Um, I still might do that, but I went through a ton of ideas and ultimately I came back to my passion that I discovered in college. And so started my side hustle in 2016 kind of a funny story. I had a former coworker of mine who called me at seven in the morning and just said, Hey, do you still want to start?
You're saying something on the side. And I said, yes. And she goes, I have your first client for you. And I'm still working with that client today, years later. And so that kicked off everything. I'm happy to share more, but that's really sort of the like launch into starting my side hustles.
Caitlyn Allen: [00:03:45] Oh, I love that. So what made you really realize, like, and find that source of inspiration to like. Start that mission that you're, you're now easily, well, not easily. You are, no, I'm working towards.
Amanda Gulino: [00:04:03] Oh, it's such a good question. I mean, the only way I know how to describe it is that this sort of like, um, insatiable, like thing that keeps bubbling up inside of me that I just really, really care about.
Um, what it comes down to, you know, is we get. One life and this form on this planet. Um, and it's short, but long. And we work a lot. We have to work a lot, or maybe we don't have to work but, we have to do something to bring in income to do the things they want to do. And there should be enjoyment tied to that.
And I just believe that in my core. Uh, that, that everybody deserves that. And I want that for everyone. So I think it's just the thing that doesn't go away and it keeps coming back no matter, no matter how much I, you know, my might've tried to like squash it down at times.
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:04:53] Okay. Um, what you guys aren't seeing is you're listening right here as Katelyn just pointed at me, even though she was gonna have the next question, but I'm going to ask it anyway. So, funny enough, you talked about like the happy accident. Someone called you up one day and was like, I have your client, your first client, Caitlin's business.
Started exactly the same way. I fired my previous assistant, called her on a Friday on my way to like Europe or something and was like, Hey, you work for me now. Basically like, Hey, help me with my travel itinerary. Yeah. So her business started because I backed her into a corner and begged her to help me until I found a new assistant.
I didn't end up finding a new assistant for like two years. So she was
there for like two years. But like now, her business has completely spiraled into this thing of its own. And yours has too. So both of you, I'm asking this question to both of you. Um, how do you. Not be resistant to those happy accidents. And then how do you backdoor the strategy to take advantage of this like golden opportunity?
Amanda Gulino: [00:06:13] Oh, that's such a good question. I mean, I think I grapple with that all the time. How to not be resistant to success is ultimately what you're saying. I mean, since this is a very candid podcast, I'm just going to share very candidly, um. In the early stages, I was not very resistant. I said yes to most opportunities really because I was super excited.
I had the energy and I saw every potential client engagement as a chance to learn what do I, what am I best at Ted's position to do here? What do I say? This isn't actually in my greatest skill set. This is someone else's greatest skill set. I'm going to refer this out and what do I ultimately want to be doing?
And so I said yes to. A lot, and I'm so glad that I did. And I think part of the challenge with that is not having a ton of resistance is overwhelming myself sometimes. Um, that, that certainly happens. Um, and yet, like. I just can't, part of me just can't even imagine having this have gone any other way because as a result is saying yes to a lot of different opportunities ultimately allowed me to take my side hustle full time, which I didn't believe I'd ever get to do.
I just told myself that would never happen. Like, who do you think you are to be able to do this? And it, those yeses and that, um, I guess lack of resistance allowed me to do that so. Yeah.
Caitlyn Allen: [00:07:38] Yeah, and I think I can relate to that and in a way, because. What happened to me was a happy accident and embracing those accidents and then making those connections, I kept saying yes to everything, girl.
I learned everything from back end of WordPress to podcasting and everything related to podcasting to how to file a trademark with Joey to how to do bookkeeping. Um. And just saying yes to a lot of things makes it so much easier now where I am in my business to say no, and to say like, yes, I can do that work.
Am I worth it to you to do that work? Because the answer is probably no. Um, and being strategic and how I say yes, no. And when I say yes, um. And I think the resistance now is a lot of like that coming back to yourself and saying, well, why did I say no? Like I could have just made more money if I just would have lowered my prices, or I would've said yes to doing some of that VA work.
But what really, at the end of the day, what you want to do is make yourself happy and make your clients happy and. Just like you said at the beginning, if you're doing work that you know you don't really want to be doing and it's not actually serving the business owner that you're working for or it is in the short term and not the long term, then why are you doing that work when you know somebody, it will fulfill somebody else.
Amanda Gulino: [00:09:20] So both hosts sign on, all of that.
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:09:24] Both of you took these happy accidents and both of you have since rebranded, completely pivoted cetera into the thing that you actually care about and want to be doing long term. So when you did that, Amanda, what was it like to. Walk away or tie up neatly, those relationships that were no longer serving where you want to be now.
And because I think a lot of us have a bit of a scarcity mindset of if I let go of this client work, I will never find quiet work to replace it. So how did you trust letting go to get what you wanted?
Amanda Gulino: [00:10:06] Yeah, I mean, I think I told myself. That the pivot I made was I started out doing a lot of recruiting work. That was my background, and I found a lot of success in it, and I loved it for a long time. And so I thought that's what I was going to want to do in my own business and loved it. And then I realized who I think I'm ready for something that's related to this, but not this anymore. And so that became coaching, training and facilitation and you know, team retreats and workshops and these sorts of things, which are super related, but it's a different set of work, you know.
And so what ultimately happened for me is I have a lot of the same clients, but we're doing different work now. And so part of what this comes back to is in a lot of my background is in nonprofit, and fundraising is a huge part of being a nonprofit. Your sustainability relies on it. And I have a friend who is an amazing fundraiser.
We used to work together and she always said, people give to people. Right? People give to people. They want to work with you and give to you because of who you are and what you represent. And so the mindset that I kept in mind as I was making this pivot where my company's values. Those did not change. My approach did not change who I am, did not change.
I stay true. And if there was a natural fit with companies and individuals and this new scope of work, we continued to work together. There were a few cases where it wasn't necessary, and I referred that workout to amazing recruiters and I'm so happy that gives me so much joy to be able to do that. Man, I can totally relate on that, uh, in that capacity as well because, um.
Caitlyn Allen: [00:11:48] When I moved out here to Arizona, I was working at a multimillion dollar nonprofit doing AmeriCorps Vista, which is domestic peace Corps. So right away you're told it's all about the story. It's all about the story, because that's how you can get people to give you money. It's always about a story. Um, and in my opinion, if you're an entrepreneur in your telling people a story, why.
Why tell a fake story when you could just be authentic and tell how you want to work or how you want to work with a company. So that's real good. That's real good.
But the other thing I wanted to ask you was what is your, what is your goal? Like what, what. What would the perfect entrepreneurial world look like for you if your goals were met?
Amanda Gulino: [00:12:43] Yeah. My goal in my life, it's not separate from my work. It's been the same for years. And my ultimate goal is just to be happy. And so that is a question and that may sound like that's got a ridiculous, there's a data tied to that. There's no numbers. Um, but that, that really is my goal. And so I check in with myself a lot on a daily basis, on a weekly basis. I do, this is real cheesy coming from us. Former HR person. Um, but I do reviews of myself every year.
Now. They're not like performance reviews or sort of numbers, but they're reflections. And I asked myself, how much did you enjoy this year? You know, like what work gave you the most joy? Where did you add the most value? These sorts of questions. And there's a, and I have a freebie, I think actually. If it's one of my website, I'll put it on there.
Um, cause it's just something, I want everybody to be able to do these, these reviews of yourself. Um, but I ask myself that a lot and if the answer is yes, I keep going and if it's not, I pause and I figure out what is the learning here. It doesn't mean I'll bow out at something or pull out of a commitment, but I will pause and ask myself what, like, what is this teaching me right now?
And like, how do I not come back to this if it's no longer serving me, um. So that, that's really ultimately my goal at that. And to be doing work that's in service of my, my mission, which is to make work better for people, make work, work better for people.
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:14:07] So I'm curious, uh. You now have to juggle multiple priorities. You have your own priorities. As a business owner, you have the priorities that your clients have essentially made top of mind because they're what's in your scope of work. You have the client's businesses, priorities, whatever those are, and then you also like want to have a personal life with priorities too.
Yeah. And how do you juggle all of those? How do you prioritize them when a lot of them deserve first billing for different reasons? What's the strategy?
Amanda Gulino: [00:14:43] Yeah, sometimes I do it well. Sometimes I don't. Um, that's the honest answer. So there are a couple of things that I do. Some of them are, hints, I took from you, Dannie.
Um, one is, I have some really, um. I guess rigid is not the right word, but some strong commitments around how I manage my calendar and my time. So I have at least one day a week where I do no external meetings at all. I get work done. They like, yes, and it works so well for me, and I call it the day I get work done.
It just, it just is what it is. Um, what also really works about that for me is one of my top personal values is freedom. And so if I've got a totally blank work day, to me that feels like I can work from 6:30 in the morning to 3:30, I can work from 6:30 to 7:30 and then go work out and come back.
I get to decide. And so that really feels like it's a grounding and a freeing experience to have those sorts of calendar boundaries, if you will. Um. I also will say that I have a lot of capacity. I just kind of figured out how to work efficiently working in under-resourced nonprofits for 10 years. It's just a, it's a blessing and a curse, I will say.
Um, but it, but it is definitely something that's helped me. Uh, the last thing, and this is kind of a funny story. Um, I have held on to this narrative that hasn't been serving me. This will sound familiar from a conversation we had at startup week, that why would I pay someone to do something that I can do myself.
So for the last however many years I've been doing everything in my business myself, with the exception of isolated projects. And last Friday, I just had a moment where I was like, not anymore. Like if this is going to be how it feels to be a business owner, I don't want to do anymore. And I knew I had a choice in that moment.
So in one day I hired. Um, my coach, someone to do my social media, um, someone to help me with scheduling. And then there's one other thing that I forgot. Oh, some support on projects where like, I just need a thought partner. You know, working alone, it can be really isolating. I loved having a team, so I brought on a couple of thought partners all on a day.
And I mean, just the transformation this week has been unreal. Um. So those are, those are some of the ways, but I think the message in there is yes, these scrappy, I don't believe that you have to spend money to make money. You can start a business on just the little bit of investment, sometimes no investments, and consider when that approach no longer serves you. Before I did, I'm like a year overdue from figuring out the support structures inside of my work.
Caitlyn Allen: [00:17:26] So outside of that, um, , which I have to say, I have a Workday Wednesday where like my Wednesdays, I don't book client meetings. And I'm like, you know, you cannot impede on my work day Wednesdays because Dannie was Dannie who, um.
What, outside of that hiring, have you made any mistakes in business that you think others could learn from? Yeah, it's priced myself way too low to start and therefore had to take on more work and we show, you all could see it cause there's some smiles coming through. I mean, this is a really common problem, especially, uh, in the work that I do with women, most of the women I coach are, most of the people I coach identify as female.
Amanda Gulino: [00:18:12] Um, and this is a very common problem, so I priced myself too low. That was a big one. Um. What else took on too much work that's very connected to pricing myself too low. And for a while I, and this is funny cause I, I used to tell my team when I would hire folks, like if you respond to emails at night and on weekends, the expectation for going forward is that you're going to respond to emails on nights and weekends and it's hard to make a change after that.
Because you're putting people through a change. It feels like they're losing part of you and you're not performing up to your standard that you used to. And yet I was working. 5:00 AM 9:00 PM seven days a week, and I had to make some changes. Um, mid engagement. And luckily most, I think everybody was very gracious.
Um, I think people respond when they see you practicing work life integration. Most people want that for themselves and don't have it. And so the response was actually really positive, um, to putting up some of those boundaries, but I had a lot of fear and doing it. Um. I guess the last thing, um,
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:19:21] to that point, I think pivoting is so hard and changing the way you communicate.
So I now have it my email signature. I'm a little italicized thing that says, I often send emails outside of nine to five. This is not because I am online or expect or will offer an immediate response. It's because work flexibility is very important to me. And then I link to this article that talks about.
What is work flexibility? Um, honestly, because I was too chicken shit to do what you did and like pivot back to not having those expectations. So this just became like my blanket excuse to email whenever I wanted.
Amanda Gulino: [00:20:00] But you know what the beauty of that is? Like it's clear. Right? It's really, really clear. Like, I'm doing this, but that doesn't mean I expect this of you. The more clear we are with ourselves and with clients, I think you can make almost anything work when you're clear, honest, authentic, and direct. Yeah. Anything.
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:20:19] Um, you also had a third point before I interrupted you. We can keep going unless I stole it from you.
Amanda Gulino: [00:20:28] No, you didn't feel, I mean, I have miss, Oh, I do remember what it was. So the word mistake, um, has come up a couple of times and I'm just wrapping up my coaching program I wrapped up a couple months ago, and there's this mantra that they shared in it that you cannot make a mistake.
And I'll be honest, for the first several months, I was like, that's bullshit. I make mistakes all the time, and yet the more I go into it, it's, and this has really helped my mindset. Um. Their perspective. And now my perspective is that at any given moment, we are doing the best we can with what we know and the tools we have available to us at that moment.
And so, because that's true, there really are no mistakes. Um, and so my, it's that mindset. If someone that can identify as a perfectionist at times has really helped me to get out of the, I don't want to make a mistake to, this is the best I can offer at this time. Right? Or this is, I am truly giving my best right now. And, and if I, if there's something that's wrong, I'm using air quotes. Um, it's not a mistake. It's just a chance for me to do better next time.
Caitlyn Allen: [00:21:37] Oh my gosh, I have so much to say on that. So first off, I have a tattoo that says never a failure. Always a lesson, because it's never a mistake. I mean, yes, you can make mistakes, right?
But. It's taking that mistake and learning from it, and like, that's what it should be, is a lesson. Um, but I totally agree with the, you made the best decision you could with the stuff in front of you. Um, and on teams that I worked for right now, we're hiring out a lot and. When you're a side hustler and you're getting hired onto these teams.
Um, specifically VA's, I know that the A's can be put in weird situations where there aren't SLPs in place, there aren't processes in place, and the owner expects the VA to know exactly what they're talking about 24, seven and that's just simply not gonna happen. Um. So if you're a VA side hustler, I feel you feel free to DM me and talk about it.
Cause that was my life for a really long time. Um, but then pulling in that, okay, well I don't want to do this anymore. The scarcity mindset of, well, if I niche, then I'm going to lose out on whatever it is. Um, how did you. Pull yourself away from the scarcity mindset and decide to actually like make the change. Like what prompted that?
Amanda Gulino: [00:23:06] I'll be honest. Um, I don't know that I got out of the scarcity mindset before I made the change. I just said. It's not working the way it is. So my options are to continue the path I'm going on and know that my state is secure, that I'm not happy in what I'm doing and I'm not fulfilling my personal mission, or I make a change and then it either works or it doesn't.
And I decided that. That was worth it to me to make the change and be open to the fact that, Hey, this might not work out for me, and that's okay. I will figure something out. Um, I also approached when I took my side hustle full time, that that was probably the. The single most fear I felt for a long amount of time because I was living in the Bay area, the most expensive area of the country.
Losing a salary, a pretty good salary, losing benefits. I mean, I was terrified, truly. And I think ultimately what helped me was, um, knowing that I have, uh, like some money scarcity stuff I still work through. I saved up about like two months or three months of expenses. So I knew I had a little bit of a runway.
I trusted myself that I'd be able to find a job if I needed to, and that amount of time if it truly bottomed out. Um, and then I approached, this was really the game changer. I approached everything like an experiment. I said, I'm giving myself 18 months, 18 months, and if this works out and I am in it, and I'm loving it at 18 months.
Awesome. And if I'm not, it was an awesome experience. I'll do something else. And that totally shifted my mindset to be able to say, I have a lot of freedom here and I'm gonna just have fun with this and that. That was probably the number one thing that has contributed to the success that I've had.
Caitlyn Allen: [00:24:56] Dannie and I are over here nodding because that's. Thats the money mindset is me to a teach of are you like, are you sure I can niche? Because what if like I get, I feel like this is one thing that people don't tell you when you start niching and when you start raising your prices though, is I've had three perspective clients come through. Super excited to get started with me.
And I've had three nos in like a span of two days, and that can feel so like, man, what am I doing? Maybe I'm doing everything wrong. Like maybe my pricing is wrong, maybe, maybe whatever. Like all of these negative thoughts. And then you're like, but wait, because when I do get that one client who is going to pay me the rate that I need to be paid at.
That that client is going to be served in ways that I don't think they've ever been served before because I'm the only one that's doing the thing that I'm doing. Um, not to say there aren't any other people like me, but they're not working with me specifically. So. Anybody out there listening. Like you get lots of nos as you niche and as you raise your prices, but it's worth it and it's so worth it to work and do the work that you want to do.
Um, so I guess that's kind of wrapping it up. Um, is there anything else you'd like to share with our audience, uh, about like your business and where can we find you on all of the internet?
Amanda Gulino: [00:26:35] Of course, of course. Thank you. Um, so what I do, I love variety, and yet I also love, uh, I think nourishing is really valuable.
So within my niche around, uh, fulfillment and enjoyment. At work, I do three things. So I work with organizations on developing, uh, people focused cultures. That's one thing. Um, love that work. I am a coach, so I work primarily with people who identify as female on a one-to-one basis. Um, frankly, dealing with a lot of the issues we've talked about today.
Money, mindset, fear, imposter syndrome, all of these sorts of things. Um, I basically in the coach that I needed like four years ago, um, so coaching and then, uh, facilitation and training and workshops, um, around. Things that I call essential workplace skills. Um, so things like feedback, healthy feedback, um, interpersonal communication.
I do some career based workshops, et cetera. And in terms of where you can find me, I'm one of these. Like rare breeds of millennials, it's not super into, are all over social media. Um, that said, you can always email me. So my email is Amanda at a betterMonday.CO not com CO. Um, my website is a great place to just check out more of what I do. And then the one place I am pretty active is on LinkedIn. Um, and so my profile is just under my name, Amanda Golino. Um, my website is a better monday.co.
Dannie Lynn Fountain: [00:28:07] Yay. Thank you so much for hanging out with us today. Yet again, Caitlyn and I have been talking all day is we're recording about how good season four is going to be, and this is yet another awesome episode. Um, so thank you, and we will see you on the internet.
Amanda Gulino: [00:28:27] Awesome. Thank y'all so much for having me.